| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Do you still charge by word/characters or rather by hour (like all other industries)? Thread poster: TTilch
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TTilch 
Local time: 18:56
English to German
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Hi,
Do you still charge by words or characters or do you charge by hour (like all other industries)?
In my personal opinion charging by words or characters is outdated - after all we do much more than "just type" every day (researching/capturing terminology, clarifiying issues with the customer, checking reference files, doing QA checks, reviewing translations and checking correct formatting, etc.). Counting words/characters certainly dates back to the old ages of the t... See more Hi,
Do you still charge by words or characters or do you charge by hour (like all other industries)?
In my personal opinion charging by words or characters is outdated - after all we do much more than "just type" every day (researching/capturing terminology, clarifiying issues with the customer, checking reference files, doing QA checks, reviewing translations and checking correct formatting, etc.). Counting words/characters certainly dates back to the old ages of the typewriter which finally disappeared about 25 years ago.
So while I still may use words and characters to get a rough idea of the total amount of text and thus hours needed to complete a job, I no longer use them to calculate my fees. After all, why should we? I never heard of a software developer being paid by line of code or assessors and surveyors charge their fee for their expert assessments by words/characters typed.
How about you? Looking forward to your replies.
Best,
Tanja ▲ Collapse
| | | | | No agency would pay my hourly rate but they gladly pay my word rate | Oct 1, 2021 |
I'm quite happy charging by the word and not by the hour. Since I started translating, I have constantly improved my translation speed, so that I can process more words per hour than before. By charging per word, the profits of this improvement go to me and not to the client or agency.
Of course I do an internal calculation of the value of my working hour, but if I would ask this hourly rate from my agencies, they would be aghast. But by charging per word, they pay it without compla... See more I'm quite happy charging by the word and not by the hour. Since I started translating, I have constantly improved my translation speed, so that I can process more words per hour than before. By charging per word, the profits of this improvement go to me and not to the client or agency.
Of course I do an internal calculation of the value of my working hour, but if I would ask this hourly rate from my agencies, they would be aghast. But by charging per word, they pay it without complaint. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Per-project pricing, at least when doing business with direct clients | Oct 1, 2021 |
I am gradually switching to dealing with direct clients. Besides obvious advantages money-wise, you can get a deep understanding of the client's business, processes, style, terminology, and preferences. Also, you can build up industry-, client- and/or project-specific TMs and termbases.
Regarding the rates... From my experience, direct clients are not that interested in your per-word, per-line, per-page, or per-hour rates. They have a budget and a timeframe. So they want to know (1)... See more I am gradually switching to dealing with direct clients. Besides obvious advantages money-wise, you can get a deep understanding of the client's business, processes, style, terminology, and preferences. Also, you can build up industry-, client- and/or project-specific TMs and termbases.
Regarding the rates... From my experience, direct clients are not that interested in your per-word, per-line, per-page, or per-hour rates. They have a budget and a timeframe. So they want to know (1) how much they will have to pay to get the job done, and (2) when you can deliver. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Erik Freitag
Germany
Local time: 18:56
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
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| My experience exactly | Oct 1, 2021 |
Kay-Viktor Stegemann wrote:
Of course I do an internal calculation of the value of my working hour, but if I would ask this hourly rate from my agencies, they would be aghast. But by charging per word, they pay it without complaint.
That's my experience, too.
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| Track your hours, even if you don’t bill hourly | Oct 1, 2021 |
Kay-Viktor Stegemann wrote:
Of course I do an internal calculation of the value of my working hour...
Hours are our most precious resource. Regardless of the pricing model, boiling it down to hourly rates is the most logical way to compare apples to apples.
| | | | Adieu
Ukrainian to English
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| How would you charge by the hour without a word/character per hour rate?? | Oct 1, 2021 |
Blind trust? Upwork-style spyware?
| | | | Jean Lachaud
United States
Local time: 12:56
English to French
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| Completely agree with you | Oct 1, 2021 |
I'm 100% with you. Unfortunately, agencies still live in the 15th century, and price themselves on the basis of copying monk rates.
I do provide, to direct customers, estimates based on my assessment of how much time I expect to spend. Unfortunately, actual time spent is usually much higher (50% not being unusual).
J L
Tanja Tilch wrote:
Hi,
Do you still charge by words or characters or do you charge by hour (like all other industries)?
In my personal opinion charging by words or characters is outdated - after all we do much more than "just type" every day (researching/capturing terminology, clarifiying issues with the customer, checking reference files, doing QA checks, reviewing translations and checking correct formatting, etc.). Counting words/characters certainly dates back to the old ages of the typewriter which finally disappeared about 25 years ago.
So while I still may use words and characters to get a rough idea of the total amount of text and thus hours needed to complete a job, I no longer use them to calculate my fees. After all, why should we? I never heard of a software developer being paid by line of code or assessors and surveyors charge their fee for their expert assessments by words/characters typed.
How about you? Looking forward to your replies.
Best,
Tanja
| | | | | Units don't matter | Oct 1, 2021 |
Agencies are wired to understand word rates, because word counts don't vary from one translator to the next. It's more convenient for them to compare prices. With not only varying rates (prices), but also bases (units) changing depending on the translator (this one quotes 3 hours, that one quotes 1.5...), it's more complicated.
Translation-agnostic clients just want a price for the translation of their brochure. No need to confuse them with units they're not accustomed to.
It'... See more Agencies are wired to understand word rates, because word counts don't vary from one translator to the next. It's more convenient for them to compare prices. With not only varying rates (prices), but also bases (units) changing depending on the translator (this one quotes 3 hours, that one quotes 1.5...), it's more complicated.
Translation-agnostic clients just want a price for the translation of their brochure. No need to confuse them with units they're not accustomed to.
It's enough that all clients understand exactly what's included in your price: a service, not buckets of words. A translation delivered with words sorted in decreasing alphabetical order will immediately remind them that you sell a service, not only typed words. A typist doesn't sell words either.
A source word count (or whatever "source" units, pages, characters, vowels, umlauts or other creative units), together with the source text, gives me an idea about the amount of time I will spend on a job before starting it. In fact, I anticipate just like you how much time I will spend on it. But then I can state my price on a word-, time- or project-basis. And I round the calculation or not depending on whether I want the price to look extremely accurately devised and thought through (no rounding) or feel like a service fee (rounded at the next ten, hundred or thou).
I also find it rather funny (but also worrying!) that some agencies accept my word rate while finding my hourly rate extortionately expensive. Since my hourly rate "matches" my word rate, my hourly earnings do not depend on the unit I quote. I dedicate a finite amount of hours to work, and each one bears the same value, whatever unit the buyer understands and wherever they're based.
Philippe ▲ Collapse
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I charge translation per word (to agencies), per character (to a media group) and per project (direct clients). I charge revision/editing/proofreading per hour (almost exclusively to agencies). I charge transcreation per project (both to agencies and to direct clients).
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 18:56
French to English
No way am I charging by the hour! With half a century of experience under my belt, I work at least twice as fast as when I was a beginner - and the end product is much much better too! What profession is going to pay beginners producing just-about competent work more than an experienced translator who produces excellent work?
| | | | ATIL KAYHAN
Türkiye
Local time: 19:56
Member (2007)
Turkish to English
+ ...
I always charge by the number of source words times my word rate. It is a very simple calculation, and one that is easy to reach a consensus with the client. If I were to charge by the hour, it would be a lot more complicated.
For example, should I include my coffee break(s), my lunch breaks, etc in the hour count? If we go by the other industries, I certainly should include them. If I were to work in a factory, I would get free coffee breaks and lunch breaks, right? Of course,... See more I always charge by the number of source words times my word rate. It is a very simple calculation, and one that is easy to reach a consensus with the client. If I were to charge by the hour, it would be a lot more complicated.
For example, should I include my coffee break(s), my lunch breaks, etc in the hour count? If we go by the other industries, I certainly should include them. If I were to work in a factory, I would get free coffee breaks and lunch breaks, right? Of course, and I would rather include them so that I get paid a bit more. On the other hand, it is obvious that the client would not like that at all. So, it is not exact science when you should start and stop the clock. If your work were to be supervised by a supervisor, then you would probably punch in and out just like you were in a factory. You are your own supervisor here. If your hour count and the client's hour count do not agree, there is a problem. However, it is easy to agree upon the word processor's word count, and your word rate. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Adieu
Ukrainian to English
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Except KISS already includes the it. That's the "I" in Keep it Simple, S...
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Philippe Etienne wrote:
Agencies are wired to understand word rates, because word counts don't vary from one translator to the next.
I think this is a key point. The word count is a fixed value that is linked to the source text. The number of hours required for the job is not a fixed value, but depends on the ability of the translator, the difficulty of the text, and other factors.
Should a translator who takes ten hours to complete a given job be paid twice as much as one who takes five? Or should the former translator charge only half the hourly rate of the latter? Who makes those decisions?
Charging by the word - or by some other fixed attribute of the source text - has the virtues of simplicity and objectivity. Discrepancies in difficulty, etc., tend to average out over time. Or you can vary your word rate based on a preliminary assessment of a job, as I do.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 18:56
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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Tanja Tilch wrote:
In my personal opinion charging by words or characters is outdated -- after all we do much more than "just type" every day (researching/capturing terminology, clarifying issues with the customer, checking reference files, doing QA checks, reviewing translations and checking correct formatting, etc.). Counting words/characters certainly dates back to the old ages of the typewriter which finally disappeared about 25 years ago.
1. Many of the things that you mention that we do besides typing, can be done much faster today that in the day of the typewriter. So if charging per word made sense in the day of the typewriter, shouldn't it make even more sense today?
2. I do no believe it is unnatural (or abnormal) to charge per product delivered instead of per hour laboured. And the size of the product can be determined most easily by counting the characters, words, or lines.
3. All of my clients are agencies, and agencies typically believe that the per-hour rate should be much lower per job than the per-word rate. I know this is illogical, but this is just how their minds work. To put it differently, agencies have an idea in their minds about acceptable ratios of per-word rate to per-hour rate. Examples from my language combination include 10:25 (10c per word, $25 per hour) and 7:15 (7c per word, $15 per hour).
So, if I did a 1000-word job for a client who pays me e.g. 10c per word, and the job takes me 1 hour to complete, then it means that I had earned $100 in that hour. But no client who pays 10c per word for translation would also willingly pay $100 per hour. 10:100 is much too high a ratio. This would mean that if I were to charge per hour for this agency (due to some misguided idea that per-word is an outdated method), I would either price myself out of most projects or have to accept a 2/3 reduction in income.
Now, I know some people might retort "what if the job takes you 8 hours?", but if you accept a 1000-word job that takes 8 hours, and you charge only 10c per word for it, then you've only got yourself to blame. Fingers burnt, lesson learnt. You should accept or reject jobs based on whether you can do it profitably at the given rate (be it per word or per hour), and/or raise your rate for jobs that take longer, or find ways to reduce the amount of time a job takes (and this can include negotiating with the client about what exactly is to be delivered).
Added: I did not read any of the replies before I posted my reply, but as you can see, we all basically say the same things. I think Philippe says it most succinctly:
Philippe Etienne wrote:
Agencies are wired to understand word rates...
[Edited at 2021-10-02 07:05 GMT]
| | | | | Pricing models (continued) | Oct 2, 2021 |
Samuel Murray wrote:
3. All of my clients are agencies, and agencies typically believe that the per-hour rate should be much lower per job than the per-word rate... To put it differently, agencies have an idea in their minds about acceptable ratios of per-word rate to per-hour rate. Examples from my language combination include 10:25 (10c per word, $25 per hour) and 7:15 (7c per word, $15 per hour).
For translation, I charge per word. For editing/revising/reviewing/proofreading (you name it), I offer my agency clients two options in my pricelist. They can opt for either per-word rate or hourly rate. Money-wise, the client pays the same amount at the end of the day.
Example:
Let's say I offer €0.10 per word. I take my average (you might say, guaranteed) throughput, e.g. 300 words per hour. This translates (pun intended) into €30.00 per hour, to be offered as my hourly rate.
You should accept or reject jobs based on whether you can do it profitably at the given rate (be it per word or per hour), and/or raise your rate for jobs that take longer, or find ways to reduce the amount of time a job takes (and this can include negotiating with the client about what exactly is to be delivered).
Exactly.
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