Glossary entry (derived from question below)
Polish term or phrase:
wężyk probierczy
English translation:
wriggled assay groove / (assay sample) wriggle-mark
Added to glossary by
Robin Gill
Mar 31, 2021 16:13
3 yrs ago
9 viewers *
Polish term
Poland
wężyk probierczy
Polish to English
Other
Materials (Plastics, Ceramics, etc.)
Silver hallmarks
From a museum catalogue:
Sorry, I have no more context than this. It's the wavy line visible in the image
Podróżny przybór do pisania
1670–1674, Augsburg
Hans III Petrus (Peters; czynny w 1621-1677)
Srebro kute, odlewane, wycinane, cyzelowane, aksamit; pudełko: 3,8 × 7,3 × 6,7 cm
Cechowane: znak miejski Augsburga, znak wykonawcy, wężyk probierczy; na dnie
Sorry, I have no more context than this. It's the wavy line visible in the image
Podróżny przybór do pisania
1670–1674, Augsburg
Hans III Petrus (Peters; czynny w 1621-1677)
Srebro kute, odlewane, wycinane, cyzelowane, aksamit; pudełko: 3,8 × 7,3 × 6,7 cm
Cechowane: znak miejski Augsburga, znak wykonawcy, wężyk probierczy; na dnie
Proposed translations
(English)
| 3 | wriggled assay groove / (assay sample) wriggle-mark |
geopiet
|
| 4 | zig-zag assay scrape |
Andrzej Mierzejewski
|
References
| wèżyk |
geopiet
|
| "zig-zag assay scrape" |
Andrzej Mierzejewski
|
Proposed translations
1 day 7 hrs
Selected
wriggled assay groove / (assay sample) wriggle-mark
(in silverwork)
a furrow left in a piece by the digging out of metal for assay - https://www.collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/english/assa...
--
Small gouge under a piece of silver, made when a sample was removed for assaying. - https://www.oxfordreference.com/view/10.1093/oi/authority.20...
--
In America the mutilating test cut (where metal is removed) is also called a knife cut, in both Britain and the continent, a chisel cut. Cuts in silver objects, usually near the hallmarks were once called assay groove in previous centuries. - https://www.coinbooks.org/v22/esylum_v22n11a15.html
---
Canongate silver with any sign of an assay-groove or gauge-mark.
--
Silver, cast, embossed, chased, fire-gilt
Master maker’s mark (Seling 2007, No. 1043) and town mark (Seling 2007, No. 1043) on the foot-ring, wriggled assay groove on the edge of the cover Engraved on the cover: ‘XV’ - https://www.kunstkammer.com/index.php/en/2413-silberbirnpoka...
--
... but the characteristic wriggled assay - groove is here present , although there is no assay - master's punch - https://t.ly/meyv
--
Marks: On the narrow vertical foot-rim at the rear of the rococo pedestal base three marks are punched, alongside an assay sample 'wriggle-mark' - https://www.britishmuseum.org/collection/object/H_WB-117
--
Continental silver gilt christening set, comprising a spoon with oval bowl with figurative, twisted stem and terminal in the form of a crowned figure, with matching fork, in a fitted case, underside of both spoon and fork with wriggle mark and stamped - W. B. T. - https://t.ly/Cfud
a furrow left in a piece by the digging out of metal for assay - https://www.collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/english/assa...
--
Small gouge under a piece of silver, made when a sample was removed for assaying. - https://www.oxfordreference.com/view/10.1093/oi/authority.20...
--
In America the mutilating test cut (where metal is removed) is also called a knife cut, in both Britain and the continent, a chisel cut. Cuts in silver objects, usually near the hallmarks were once called assay groove in previous centuries. - https://www.coinbooks.org/v22/esylum_v22n11a15.html
---
Canongate silver with any sign of an assay-groove or gauge-mark.
--
Silver, cast, embossed, chased, fire-gilt
Master maker’s mark (Seling 2007, No. 1043) and town mark (Seling 2007, No. 1043) on the foot-ring, wriggled assay groove on the edge of the cover Engraved on the cover: ‘XV’ - https://www.kunstkammer.com/index.php/en/2413-silberbirnpoka...
--
... but the characteristic wriggled assay - groove is here present , although there is no assay - master's punch - https://t.ly/meyv
--
Marks: On the narrow vertical foot-rim at the rear of the rococo pedestal base three marks are punched, alongside an assay sample 'wriggle-mark' - https://www.britishmuseum.org/collection/object/H_WB-117
--
Continental silver gilt christening set, comprising a spoon with oval bowl with figurative, twisted stem and terminal in the form of a crowned figure, with matching fork, in a fitted case, underside of both spoon and fork with wriggle mark and stamped - W. B. T. - https://t.ly/Cfud
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thank you very much indeed. Sterling reference work."
4 hrs
Andrzej Mierzejewski
Poland
Poland
Native in Polish
Specializes in field
Poland
M.Sc. Engineer (Mechanics)
Native in: Polish
Works in: Polish to English, English to Polish, German to Polish, and 3 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
26
zig-zag assay scrape
Based on the reference below.
Another wording may be known to professionals, that's why confidence 4/5.
Another wording may be known to professionals, that's why confidence 4/5.
Reference comments
10 mins
Reference:
wèżyk
Kiedy mowa o próbowaniu srebra, godzi się wspomnieć często spotykany na dawnych wyrobach tzw. wężyk probierczy. Ta zygzaowato ryta linia długości paru centymetrów towarzyszy zazwyczaj znakom probierczym. Jest to ślad pobrania dłutkiem niewielkiego wióra będącego próbką metalu dla oznaczenia metodą ogniową ilości srebra w stopie, słowem jest to ślad działalności probierza. Próba ogniowa była w dawnych czasach najprecyzyjniejszą metodą probierczą. W XIX w. oznaczano tak dokładnie zawartość srebra metodą narysu, że nie istniała konieczność pobierania próbek i wężyk probierczy nie pojawia się już na ówczesnych wyrobach
Note from asker:
| Dziękuję bardzo. |
4 hrs
Andrzej Mierzejewski
Poland
Poland
Native in Polish
Specializes in field
Poland
M.Sc. Engineer (Mechanics)
Native in: Polish
Works in: Polish to English, English to Polish, German to Polish, and 3 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
26
Reference:
"zig-zag assay scrape"
One German site:
https://silbersuite.de/augsburger-silbermarken-beschauzeiche... - several photos showing the same mark on several items. Find "tremulierstrich" as in:
Der Geschaumeister überprüfte den vorgeschriebenen Silberfeingehalt mittels einer Silberprobe - dem Tremulierstrich - und schlug dann die Stadtmarke als Zeichen der Garantie für den Silberfeingehalt ein.
And one British site:
https://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18970
in particular:
Is there an English equililent for the German Tremulierstrich, which ich jagged mark put on antique silver. It is apparently a mark which guarantees that the silver was tested twice.
It is a rather unsightly and long jagged mark and I wonder why they couldn't come up with a more elegant one.
The final reply:
I have always known this as an "assay scrape". If I wanted to be more descriptive I would expand this to "zig-zag assay scrape".
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 godz. (2021-03-31 20:40:38 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Well, maybe not British, but Canadian or U.S., I can't be sure. The UTC -4:00 time zone is valid for a small parts of Canada and the US. See
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/68/Standard...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 18 godz. (2021-04-01 10:41:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Jeszcze jeden link:
"The spoon is definitely silver because of the ‘zig-zag’ mark which is called and Assay scrape which was done to remove metal from the spoon to determine the quality of the silver."
[...]
"the zig zag is not a guanrantee for silver. It is assayers test for silver - yes. But not a gurantee mark."
https://www.silver-collector.com/t/identify-hallmarks/8820/3
https://silbersuite.de/augsburger-silbermarken-beschauzeiche... - several photos showing the same mark on several items. Find "tremulierstrich" as in:
Der Geschaumeister überprüfte den vorgeschriebenen Silberfeingehalt mittels einer Silberprobe - dem Tremulierstrich - und schlug dann die Stadtmarke als Zeichen der Garantie für den Silberfeingehalt ein.
And one British site:
https://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18970
in particular:
Is there an English equililent for the German Tremulierstrich, which ich jagged mark put on antique silver. It is apparently a mark which guarantees that the silver was tested twice.
It is a rather unsightly and long jagged mark and I wonder why they couldn't come up with a more elegant one.
The final reply:
I have always known this as an "assay scrape". If I wanted to be more descriptive I would expand this to "zig-zag assay scrape".
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 godz. (2021-03-31 20:40:38 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Well, maybe not British, but Canadian or U.S., I can't be sure. The UTC -4:00 time zone is valid for a small parts of Canada and the US. See
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/68/Standard...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 18 godz. (2021-04-01 10:41:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Jeszcze jeden link:
"The spoon is definitely silver because of the ‘zig-zag’ mark which is called and Assay scrape which was done to remove metal from the spoon to determine the quality of the silver."
[...]
"the zig zag is not a guanrantee for silver. It is assayers test for silver - yes. But not a gurantee mark."
https://www.silver-collector.com/t/identify-hallmarks/8820/3
Discussion
In one Polish site "wężyk" was translated as "hose". I suggest not to use that translation. ;-)